Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.bass Organization: Fujitsu New Zealand, Auckland From: derek@nezsdc.fujitsu.co.nz (Derek Tearne) Subject: Re: Steps on Boiling strings/Slot the Bridge! Date: 13 Feb 1996 12:43:31 +1300 In article <4fi8ds$rru@newsreader.wustl.edu>, Jeffrey L. Suits wrote: >On my basses, I've cut slots in the bridges, so that the strings can be out, >and in boiling water, in about twenty seconds(I shit thee not!). The bridge on my bass came that way. >This way, >it's not _quite_ such a production. I boil for at least 20 minutes, w/ either >a little vinegar or lemon juice, dry them, and FREEZE THEM. I used to boil them with some washing up liquid for about 30-40 minutes (makes a noticeable difference from just 20). Now I stick them in the dishwasher - they gained a lot more tone and have kept it for as long as new strings would have. >Several other >bassists around here(St. Louis) have started doing it this way, and agree that >this poor-man's tempering process works miracles. This is more like a poor mans hardening process... letting the strings cool slowly would be tempering. I doubt that heating the strings to a mere 100C and then cooling is going to make much difference to the mechanical properties of the metal whether cooled in the air or in the fridge. I dry mine on a towel to remove as much water as possible - water trapped between the coils would be bad as it can promote corrosion etc. I would suggest, considering that water expands when it freezes, that putting the strings in the freezer is more likely to cause damage than air drying. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar Organization: NASA/Johnson Space Center From: Billy Joe Donnelly Subject: Re: Changing strings on a Telecaster Date: 31 Jan 1996 14:42:06 GMT I believe the posts are like this to keep the headstock tidy in case you want to bend behind the nut without getting string ends stuck through your fingers. The best way to restring is to have needle nose pliers and a wire cutter handy. (I have both combined in 1 tool). Wrap the string 3, 4, or 5 times around the post (depending on string thickness), and on the last wind go through the slot, making a right angle bend. Back the string out a little without losing all your winds (hold a finger on the spooled wire) and using pliers make another right angle bend turned down a distance of 1/2 the post diameter past the first bend. Cut off the string so it's just long enough to go into the bottom of the hole in the post. Keep a finger on the spool and one nose of the pliers pushing the string in the hole, as you tighten the string. You ought to practice with a couple of high 'E' strings to get the mechanics down. It's tough at first, but once you get the hang of it, it's cake. Billy Joe From: jps@cup.portal.com (John P Sheehy) Newsgroups: alt.guitar Subject: Re: action/intonation Q Date: 7 Apr 1995 17:20:25 -0700 Organization: The Portal System (TM) >Could you explain to me how I could tell if the intonation on my guitar >needs adjustment. Frequently, after tuning my guitar, it still sounds out >of tune. Also, what is the best way to adjust the intonation. The guitar may sound out of tune, even if it is perfect. Major chords have their 3rds slightly sharp on a standard guitar. If you listen real close to a major chord on a properly tuned guitar, it will sound like the 3rd wants to be flattened a bit. You have to learn to ignore this, and anyway, people listening to your playing will not dwell on that the way you do. They will be listening mainly to rhythm and the succession of chords. Does your guitar have adjustable bridge saddles? If they are fixed (like most acoustics), the best you can do is get your truss rod properly adjusted, and use the gauge of strings the guitar was designed for. This should get you close. (It may be possible to get fixed and adjustable replacement saddles for some acoustics, too). If the saddles are movable, then you can get your intonation just about perfect in most cases, if you do it properly. A lot of people say you can check the intonation of a guitar by comparing the 12th fret note on a string with the 12th fret harmonic. This is a short and sweet method, but it is just about the worst possible way to do it, as it is filled with all kinds of potential for error. If you have a good chromatic tuner, you can check the intonation by simply playing notes all along the length of the string, and see if there are any general trends, like the higher notes being progressively sharper or flatter. If your intonation is good, when you tune the string based on one fret, all the frets will be in tune as well, or pretty close. If they get sharper toward the bridge, you need to move the saddle away from the neck. If they get flatter toward the bridge, you need to move the saddle closer to the neck. Retune and try again, until all ranges on the fretboard are in tune. If your guitar has at least 17 frets, you can check the intonation another way (a little more accurately). This method entails tuning a fretted note in the lower range of the string to be tested with an open string of the same note name, and then comparing the note 12 frets higher than the fretted one with the open string. For example, to test the B string, tune the 5th fret note (E) to the open high E string, so that there is no beating. Next, compare the E at the 17th fret of the B string to the open high E. If it (17th fret) is sharper, move the saddle away from the neck. If it is flatter, move the saddle toward the neck. Retune and retest until the 5th and 17th frets are in tune. How are you tuning your guitar? If you are comparing the 5th fret of the B to the E, and the fourth fret of the G to the B, and the 5th fret of the D to the G, etc, you are headed for disaster. This is the worst way to tune a guitar. Better ways: Get an A440 tuning fork, and tune a fretted A on each string to it (best), or, Tune a fretted note on each string with a (chromatic) tuner. If you have a tuner that only does E-A-D-G-B-E, tune by the notes on the 4th and 5th frets on the next lower strings instead of the open ones. For the high E, tune a fretted note to the one an octave lower on the G string. As you may have noticed, my advice doesn't employ open strings at all, except as a temporary reference note in the second intonation method. The reason for this is that most guitars do not have nuts with very accurate pitches. The frets are all perfectly aligned, but the nuts can be leaning flat or sharp, can be too high, or the vibrating node may not occur where it is supposed to. Basing any intonation or tuning on these open string notes can lead to problems unless you know for a FACT that your nut is near perfect. I'm not talking about $40 guitars here, either. I'm talking name brands that cost several hundred dollars. A simple way to test if your guitar is "perfect" or not: Tune the E on the 9th fret of the G string to the open high E string, so that there is no beating. Now compare the open G to the G on the 3rd fret of the high E string. Still in tune? Any beating? If they are not in tune then either the nut is bad or the intonation is bad. If you have a chromatic tuner, you can check the integrity of the nut by comparing the "intune"-ness of the open string to that of the first fret. If your open strings are accurate, then some of the other tuning and intonation methods may work, but they're still not as good as the ones I recommended. John Sheehy Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar Organization: MindSpring Enterprises From: kera@mindspring.com (Ken Brakebill) Subject: Buzz Feiten Tuning Secrets REVEALED!! Date: Sun, 01 Jun 1997 13:57:23 GMT While surfing DejaNews I came across this informative posting from rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic. (Most of us don't surf in those waters...) It actually says something useful about this nothing-new-under-the-sun, so-called "system" that Buzz and his Lawyers have duped the Patent Examiner with. Please Read and Be Informed. See additional comments at bottom. Satchmo was right -- "Oh what a wonderful world we live in!" ***************************************************************************************** Subject: Re: Q: Buzz Feiten's 'Revolutionary' tempered tuning system. From: conecaster@aol.com (Conecaster) Date: 1997/04/29 Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic Thanks for letting me have an oppurtunity to vent about this subject. I would say keep your $2000 dollars. There is nothing new at all about the Buzzy Feiten tunning method and the best way to dispell the myth of its novelty is for the truth about the system to be made public. I have been tuning guitars this way for years. I have done it for players like Earl Klugh, Chet Atkins, Don Potter, Steve Earl and many others. Often they never know I did it because I didn't talk about it with them. But one day I got a call from Chet who asked " Paul, your guitar and my old D'Angelico are the only two guitar I have that tune, Why is that?" I told him about Nut compensation and presumed his D'Angelico must have it (Any D'Angelico owners want to measure one for me). Some friends where at his office in the following days and found him cutting wood off the ends of the fret boards of his electric guitars. "Paul says this works and he's right", he said. The concept of moving the frets closer to the nut to compensate tuning in the first position has been around so long that it is hard to say who first discovered it. It works like this: When you fret a note at the 12th fret the string is stretched the full length between the nut and saddle, half the tension is absorbed between the 11th fret and the nut and the other half between 12th fret and the saddle. This means that the pitch is increased by only half of the total tension applied, because only half the string is oscilating. When depressing a note at the first fret it actually requires more pressure than at the 12th fret. This is because the strings have to be ever so slightly higher than the fret to eliminate back buzzing and because the strings can be effected by the stiffining effect of string angle over the nut on to the head stock or even other more subtle effects of the strings in this position. So, in the first position the total increase in pitch is greater because a greater area of the string, still under a similar amount of tension increase from stretching at the 12th fret, is vibrating. The system has one draw back, that is notes compared an octave apart at an interval of seven frets apart will not syncronize. This is a small price to pay for the guitar to tune extremely well in all other positions. The so calledd Buzzy Feiten tuning system as used on Tom Anderson Electric Guitars is not complete in its anticipation of tuning on an unwound third string. G sharp will still be sharp on the first fret because the density of the string being a greater diameter requires even more compensation. In theory all strings require their own exact nut placement to tune the most actuately depending apon string density or mass. I have had success with placing a shim on the fret board an additional 1mm closer to the first fret on top of the original 1mm of compensation generally required to tune the other strings at the nut. I can point to many examples of this tuning method through out the history of guitar making, however the best single example of this method is the sliding nut design used by Microfrets guitars and can be seen in many vintage guitar books. This design is far superior to the so called Buzzy Feiten tuning method in that it allows the instrument to be adjust for intonation with any diameter string. " Vintage Guitar" magazine published an article a while back about this instrument as well. A revolution? hardly! I would never have honestly tried to patent this design knowing that there is a history like this out there. I have been aware of this method for ten years. As for patenting a series of tuning intervals related to saddle compensation corresponding with the nut compensation, This further compensation is obvious and again anticipted by Microfrets. Buzzy if you are out there, did the Patent examiner ever see an example of a Microfrets guitar? Was the existence of this instrument not known to you? I can hardly imagine that a player of your vast experience had never seen or heard of one, but I will give you the benefit of the doubt mostly because I love those Ricky Lee Jones Albumns you played on many years ago. If your luthier needs advice from someone who has great experience with this method of tunning have him E-mail me and I will tell him anything he wants to know. He doesn't need to worry about law suits. If they call, send them a picture of a Micro frets guitar and ask the question "how does what we did differ from what they did?" All is fair in love, war and, marketing. The later is what all this is about. Lot's of folks buying into the ride. Not here. One of the last secrets in this business has been sacrificed unjustly. Paul McGill ***************************************************************************************** NOTE: The Buzz Feiten "system" costs a luthier $3000 up front, then $35-50 per instrument -- depending on the instrument's value. OUCH!! Another excuse to raise the price of our guitars? Calling all starving musicians... Let's nip this nonsense in the bud. Why should we pay a fee for something that has been in use for decades? The true innovators in this area are MicroFrets and the Novax fanned-fret system, among others. My Steinberger, with a zero fret nut, also has wonderful intonation (as long as it's not ME playing it -- but that's another story!) I doubt Ned Steinberger consulted Buzz Feiten while designing his breakthrough guitar. REALITY CHECK Even if the guitar were theoretically in tune at all positions, many (if not most) players don't use the technique required -- proper finger position and even, light pressure -- to make the guitar play in tune anyway. That is, if they can hear such microtonal subtleties in the first place. Here's wishing everyone Peace, Harmony and a Properly Tuned Mind Ken Brakebill, Atlanta, GA Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar,rec.music.makers.builders,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic Organization: Netcom From: jsheehy@ix.netcom.com (John Sheehy) Subject: Re: Buzz Feiten Tuning Secrets REVEALED!! Date: Mon, 02 Jun 1997 00:39:54 GMT kera@mindspring.com (Ken Brakebill) writes: >While surfing DejaNews I came across this informative posting from >rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic. (Most of us don't surf in those >waters...) It actually says something useful about this >nothing-new-under-the-sun, so-called "system" that Buzz and his >Lawyers have duped the Patent Examiner with. > >Please Read and Be Informed. See additional comments at bottom. > >Satchmo was right -- "Oh what a wonderful world we live in!" > >***************************************************************************************** > >Subject: Re: Q: Buzz Feiten's 'Revolutionary' tempered tuning >system. >From: conecaster@aol.com (Conecaster) >Date: 1997/04/29 >Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic >>The concept of moving the frets closer to the nut to compensate tuning >>in the first position has been around so long that it is hard to say >>who first discovered it. It works like this: >> >>When you fret a note at the 12th fret the string is stretched the >>full length between the nut and saddle, half the tension is absorbed >>between the 11th fret and the nut and the other half between 12th fret >>and the saddle. This means that the pitch is increased by only half >>of the total tension applied, because only half the string is >>oscilating. When depressing a note at the first fret it actually >>requires more pressure than at the 12th fret. This is because the >>strings have to be ever so slightly higher than the fret to eliminate >>back buzzing and because the strings can be effected by the stiffining >>effect of string angle over the nut on to the head stock or even >>other more subtle effects of the strings in this position. So, in the >>first position the total increase in pitch is greater because a >>greater area of the string, still under a similar amount of tension >>increase from stretching at the 12th fret, is vibrating. Sorry, but this thing about percentages of the string vibrating is pure fiction. The only reasons you have a sharpness at the first fret are that you are increasing tension due the sharp bends you are making, and the fact that you have to push the string down into a corner, creating an increase in it's length. The same thing happens as you get closer to the bridge as well. That is exactly why there is saddle compensation. Imagine how hard it would be to fret if there were a 48th fret, or a 900th fret! Imagine an exaggerated side view of a guitar as pictured below: |saddle | nut| | |_________________________________________________| | | | | | | | | | 10% 20% 30% 40% 50% 60% 70% 80% 90% For the sake of argument, I have replaced the normal logarithmic equal temperament fret spacings, with percentages of the fretboard from the nut. My purpose is to demonstrate that the area of least tension when fretting, is somewhere near the middle of the fretboard, but closer to the nut. As we know, the increase in pitch is related to (but not directly proportional to) the increase in string length when fretting. When we fret, we roughly create two tringles, whose hypotenuses are the two sections of string divided at the fret. For the 12th fret, this would be two lines; one from the top of the line marked nut to the 50% mark, and the other from the 50% mark to the top of the line marked saddle. We can calculate the total stretched string length for all the positions from 10% to 90% by adding the hypotenuses of the two triangles formed. With a scale length of 25", a nut 0.25" high, and a saddle 0.5" high, we get the following total string lengths: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- #include #include double nutheight=0.25, saddleheight=0.5; double percent, fromnut, hyp1, hyp2, totallength; void main() { for(percent=10.0;percent<99.0;percent+=10.0) { fromnut=0.25*percent; hyp1=sqrt(pow(fromnut,2.0)+pow(nutheight,2.0)); hyp2=sqrt(pow(25.0-fromnut,2.0)+pow(saddleheight,2.0)); totallength=hyp1+hyp2; printf("%1.1f%% %2.6f\n", percent, totallength); } printf("Press ENTER to close\n"); getchar(); } ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The output is: 10.0% 25.018024 <- moderate tension 20.0% 25.012495 30.0% 25.011307 <- least tension 40.0% 25.011456 50.0% 25.012496 60.0% 25.014575 70.0% 25.018434 80.0% 25.026500 90.0% 25.050899 <- most tension As you can see, there is no direct relationship between the percentage of the string vibrating, and the added tension of fretting. Fretting near either extreme of the string increases tension, and the amount it increases depends on how high the bridge or saddle is. Look what happens when we have a zero fret; an effective nut height of 0.0 inches: 10.0% 25.005555 <- least tension 20.0% 25.006249 30.0% 25.007141 40.0% 25.008331 50.0% 25.009996 60.0% 25.012492 70.0% 25.016648 80.0% 25.024938 90.0% 25.049510 <- most tension The tension is least at the lower frets here, even though the greatest percentage of the string is vibrating at the lower frets. >>The system >>has one draw back, that is notes compared an octave apart at an >>interval of seven frets apart will not syncronize. This is a small >>price to pay for the guitar to tune extremely well in all other >>positions. What? How do we get 7 fret octaves? [Back to Ken]: >REALITY CHECK >Even if the guitar were theoretically in tune at all positions, many >(if not most) players don't use the technique required -- proper >finger position and even, light pressure -- to make the guitar play in >tune anyway. That is, if they can hear such microtonal subtleties in >the first place. No, poorly intonated guitars are a big and real problem. Lots of people go nuts trying to get their guitars to sound right. <>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> John P Sheehy ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com From: rroy0307@aol.com (RRoy0307) Subject: Tuning and Harmony Issues Date: 1 May 1997 02:13:42 GMT I read with much interest the recent discussions here on tuning. The following is an article I've written that may help some of you who have been following this debate. I don't know if the format of the table in the middle will hold for everyone. You may have to work on it with a text editor to straighten it out. I await the flames. Go ahead take your best shots. How do you tune your guitar? Do you have an electronic tuner? Maybe you use a rack mounted model. Do you use a pitch pipe? Maybe you have a piano or other keyboard instrument that you have to be in pitch with. Maybe you use the unisons of adjacent strings at the 4th and 5th fret. Some will use the harmonics at the 5th and 7th fret. I confess, I have used all of the above methods at some time or other. Whatever the method you use, unless it is an electronic tuner, you need to understand the imperfections that are built into the tuning system we use known as "equal temperament" in order to be a good tuner and stay friends with the rest of your band- or jam-mates. Nobody likes to hear an out of tune guitar no matter how good the tone. Equal temperament means that all the intervals in the scale are equally separated from each other. Let's look at what that means. A primary parameter of a musical scale is that octave tones must be perfect. Even slightly out of tune octaves will be recognized immediately as undesirable. So how do we divide up the rest of the frequencies to build a scale. In the twelve tone, equal temperament scale we find the number that can be taken to the twelth power to equal 2 (i.e. N x N x N x N x N x N x N x N x N x N x N x N = 2). In other words, N = the twelth root of 2 or 1.05946. To get from note to note (half-step or semitone) you take the frequency of the first and multiply it by the twelth root of 2 to get the frequency of the next highest note or divide by the twelth root of 2 to get the frequency of the next lowest note. This quality of equalness between notes makes a lot of things possible in music. This includes having multi-stringed, multi-octave instruments that can play in multiple key signatures. It is probably the best compromise but it is not perfect. The primary problem with equal temperament is that it doesn't match perfectly with what is called the natural harmonic series (refer to previous article). In other words, perfect harmony is not achieved using the equal temperament system. I've composed the following table that shows actual frequencies of the A 440 to A 880 chromatic scale in the "pure tuning" and the equal temperment system and the cents error (- = flat and + = sharp) of the equal system when compared to the pure harmonic frequencies of the pure tuning NOTE RATIO PURE EQUAL CENTS TUNING Hz TEMP Hz ERROR A 1:1 440 440 0.00 Bb 16:15 469.33 466.16 -11.73 B 9:8 495 493.88 - 3.92 C 6:5 528 523.25 -15.65 Db 5:4 550 554.36 +13.67 D 4:3 586.67 587.32 + 1.92 Eb 10:7 (7:5) 628.57 (616) 622.25 -17.49 (+17.49) E 3:2 660 659.25 - 1.97 F 8:5 704 698.46 -13.68 Gb 5:3 733.33 739.99 +15.65 G 16:9 782.22 783.99 + 3.91 Ab 15:8 825 830.61 +11.73 A 2:1 880 880 0.00 When you refer to this chart you must remember that it is based on a fundamental of A = 440 Hz. If you change the fundamental then all the pure tuning frequencies change accordingly. The cents error column would be the same however. That is to say that in equal temperament, relative intervals, i.e. 2nds, 3rds, etc., are always equally out of tune with their fundamental. When I first completed this chart the thing that I noticed was that it shows a mirror image. Notice that the cents error are virtually identical with the opposite sign if you start at the bottom and work up or at the top and work down. Notice, too, that the tritone interval (Eb for the A fundamental) has 2 possible pure harmonies one 17.5 cents sharp and another 17.5 cents flat. This probably adds to the "tension" of the tritone that demands to be resolved as in a seventh chord where there is a tritone between the dominant seventh and third intervals in the chord. The chart points out the the more serious errors in the equal system are the thirds, both major and minor. You can prove this to yourself with your guitar. First, tune the guitar perfectly using an electronic tuner if you have one. Then play an open G chord leaving the B string open as the third in the chord. Next, tune the B string 13 cents flat and play the chord again. You should find that the chord is much "sweeter". Now if you try to play another chord such as a D where the B string is playing another interval in the chord (fundamental in a D chord) you will find it horribly out of tune. If you've ever listened to a barbarshop quartet and wondered why the harmonies on your guitar just never sounded that "sweet" or pure, then that is the price we pay for using equal temperment. But then, we really don't have a choice. Voices can be trained to sing the pure harmonies, guitars cannot. So, let's talk about tuning a guitar by the different methods. Tuning without an electronic device, i.e. "by ear" means establishing a fundamental somewhere. Let's say the high E string. Then other strings are then tuned relative to that. When you tune the B string to the E you must remember that the B is a fifth to the E. Referring to the chart above you see that an equal tempered fifth interval (E is a fifth to the A in the chart) is approximately 2 cents flat from the perfect harmonic of the fundamental. When tuning two tones you are first trying to eliminate "beats" from their sound. Beats are resonances that occur when two closely tuned intervals move in and out of phase with each other. When the intervals being tuned are a fifth apart though the fifth must be slightly flattened for equal temperament so that there are some beats in a properly tuned fifth interval. This is the main reason that people find it difficult to tune without some sort of aid such as an electronic tuner. You are trying to perfectly tune an imperfect interval. The more difficult interval on the guitar to tune is the third between the G and B strings. From the chart you see that an equal temperament third is 13.7 cents sharp from the pure harmonic. This could also be seen the minor sixth (decending third) being 13.7 cents flat. Piano tuners avoid tuning third intervals like the plague because of this. When tuning the G or B string it is best not to attempt it by playing both strings open at the same time. It is best to tune by unisons or octaves, especially for the G and B strings. Unisons and octaves are the only perfect intervals in equal temperament. How about tuning by harmonics such as at the 5th and 7th fret for adjacent strings. This really presents you with the same problem as when tuning the strings open. You can't tune 100% accurately with harmonics unless you tune the beats out and then slightly flatten the string that is the fifth (the lower string). Problems can multiply if you tune the whole guitar to perfect (no beat) 5th and 7th fret harmonics, i.e. 2 cents error on the fourth string, +2 = 4 cents error on the fifth string, +2 = 6 cents error on the sixth string. For best results, I recommend tuning by unisons and/or octaves and then checking with unisons and/or octaves. Try the following: 1. Establish an E fundamental on the 1st and 6th strings. Check with the 6th string at the 12th fret against the open 1st string. 2. Tune the 2nd string to unison at the 5th fret with the open 1st string and check its octave at the 17th fret against the open 1st string. 3. Tune the 3rd string to unison at the 4th fret with the open 2nd string. Check with the unison at the 9th fret and the open 1st string and the octave at the 9th fret and the 1st string at the 12th fret. 4. Tune the 4th string to unison at the 5th fret with the open 3rd string. Check the unison at the 14th fret with the open 1st string and the octave at the 14th fret with the 1st string at the 12th fret. 5. Tune the 5th string to unison at the 5th fret with the open 4th string. Check the unison at the 7th fret with the 3rd string at the 9th fret and the octave at the 7th fret with the open 1st string. (All three can be played together also.) 6. Check the 6th string for unison at the 5th fret with the open 5th string. Recheck the 6th string at the 12th fret against the open 1st string. 7. Repeat as needed. This works fairly well if your guitar is well set up, the intonation is correct, your strings are in good shape, and you are very patient. Otherwise, buy an electronic tuner. Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com From: fulltone@aol.com (Fulltone) Subject: Re: Anyone Use Those Graphtec Saddles ? Date: 6 Jun 1997 03:39:39 GMT Yes, the Graphteks work but be prepared for a drastic tonal change towards the darkside....my recommendation is to slip on some 1/2" lengths of PVC/vinyl or plastic coating that can be found on common 22ga. hookup electrical wire. Just strip off a little section and slip over when you change strings so that any sharp edges, just past the saddles and going into the body, are protected. this, of course, is also effective on strat-type guitars as well and doesn't dull your tone. Mike Fuller http://www.fulltone.com Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com From: sefstrat@aol.com (SEFSTRAT) Subject: Re: PR: Custom 22 vs McCarty Date: 16 Sep 1997 02:17:16 GMT <> There is a trick to them that Paul Reed Smith showed me when he was here. Of course, it's not in their literature! Once the cam on the tuner is locked on the string, and before getting to pitch, you push the little wing-piece down, into a more 'locked' position. Nothing ever slips, then. But if you do not do this, the unwound strings do indeed slip. It's hard to describe, but easy to demonstrate in 15 seconds. A friend of mine had this problem, and I showed him this little trick. He tells me that the problem's gone now. Steve SEFSTRAT Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar,alt.guitar Organization: MCSNet Services From: "Teleologist" Subject: Re: Slotted Tuning Keys on Tele - Help Please !!! Date: 22 Feb 1997 03:09:23 GMT Don Zorn wrote in article <5ekp5s$5mp@lana.zippo.com>... > Just got a RI tele and it's a major pain getting the unwound > strings to hold on the slotted tuning keys. Any tips/tricks > would be appreciated. I can't figure out how they could > get enough friction to stay in place, and the high E is so > far front that there's barely enough string slack to wind > anything on it. > Cut the string 2" beyond the post. Insert the end all the way down the hole in the center of the post. Bend the string out the side of the slot & wind it on using a string winder (the D'Andrea or Fender ones work great on vintage sized keys) while keeping some tension on it with your other hand. You should end up with about 4-6 neatly wrapped turns around the post on the unwound E and 2-3 turns on the wound E. The turns should go down towards the headstock. Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.guitar,alt.guitar Organization: CompuServe Incorporated From: 72540.276@compuserve.com (Rick French) Subject: Re: Slotted Tuning Keys on Tele - Help Please !!! Date: Sun, 23 Feb 1997 03:13:10 GMT Try this (from the Erlewine book): 1) Run the string through the body and over the bridge, and pull it up to the headstock, stopping at the peg you're getting ready to wind. 2) Measure about 2.5 inches past the peg, and cut the string there. 3) Stick the end of the string down to the bottom of the hole in the center of the peg, bend it down into the slot, and start winding. You'll end up with three or four turns on each peg. I string my Tele this way and it stays in tune nicely. Don Zorn wrote: >Just got a RI tele and it's a major pain getting the unwound >strings to hold on the slotted tuning keys. Any tips/tricks >would be appreciated. I can't figure out how they could >get enough friction to stay in place, and the high E is so >far front that there's barely enough string slack to wind >anything on it.